JUST TODAY CHANGE OF INGREDIENTS

[Javas Mom]

Garypen, I have a question for you...  My three guys love a variety, which has been REALLY hard to come up with this last 7 weeks.  I have the CN herring and sweet potato as just something I throw in the mix every once in a while when they get bored with Chicken and Rice or their Fromm's.  Is the higher carbs really a problem if you've got young, healthy cats?

[lacy]

I would like to know that too. I wanted to give them chicken and rice, and throw the herring in the mix too.

[garypen]

I don't know specifically. However, just about all cat nutrition experts recommend low levels of carbs in a cat's diet. Even the 27% of CN C&R would be too high, according to them. So, I try and keep it as low as possible, without going to one of those high-meat dry foods that are too high in calories such as Evo, Core, and the like.

Although, I am thinking of trying Timberwolf Serengeti as another dry food, as it is only 25 kcal more per cup (about 420 total vs. 550-650), but is grain-free. It does have potatoes, which can certainly cause high carb levels. But, as of yet, I haven't found any documentation of its carb level.

[Geff]

I don't think you are nuts.

For one thing; the 3 million chickens already out there...were sold in Feb. Which means that those of us (including our pets) who eat chicken have already possibly eaten it.

I hadn't even thought of the Chickens in the pet food (I'd just thought about me eating them!) ....... AAAARRRGGGHHH!

[alek0]

Garypen,

Timberwolf Serengeti should be 27.5% carbs. It is 38% protein, 2.5% fiber, 18% fat, 9% mosture, 5% ash, so when you add all that up all what is left is carbohydrates. Also, I e_mailed them recently to ask if their label is correct and they said yes. Not sure how much that can be trusted, but I still have a few bags with same or earlier pullout date than what I've been using.
Detailed ingredients of Serengeti can be found here:
http://timberwolforganics.com/c.632216/pdfs/Serengeti%20Herbal%20Felid%20Diet.pdf

I've been happy with it so far, I've started using it to replace Felidae shortly before first recall. My problem is that I always used to rotate dry foods, one chicken based, one lamb based, one venison based. Now that I can't use Natural Balance or Solid Gold, not sure what I can use in combination with Serengeti. I've been thinking about Nature's Variety and Stella&Chewy's freeze dried. Anybody has experience with that?

California Natural Chicken and Rice is OK food, but it also has chicken as a main protein source, and so does Felidae so not sure what I can use in addition to Serengeti.

[Geff]

As an fyi, I was able to find 2 bags of Cal Nat Chicken & Rice with October 2007 pull dates at the first store I tried & I snatched them up.  That + the 15 pounds or so that I have open & the 1 pound of samples should keep us (theoretically) safe through at least August.

I'm sharing this because it shows that are are still bags available at retail from a time that no one has reported problems with.

I also bought a fancy expensive boutique metal painted cat food container. We won't discuss what that cost........

[Cindy Nevarez]

Geff,
Be sure to freeze your excess, even though it's unopened. It'll stay fresh untl you're ready to use it.

[garypen]

Garypen,

Timberwolf Serengeti should be 27.5% carbs. It is 38% protein, 2.5% fiber, 18% fat, 9% mosture, 5% ash, so when you add all that up all what is left is carbohydrates. Also, I e_mailed them recently to ask if their label is correct and they said yes. Not sure how much that can be trusted, but I still have a few bags with same or earlier pullout date than what I've been using.
Detailed ingredients of Serengeti can be found here:
http://timberwolforganics.com/c.632216/pdfs/Serengeti%20Herbal%20Felid%20Diet.pdf

I've seen their product page. That's what made me interested. It looks good on paper, for the most part. But, if it has roughly 27% carbs, it's about the same as CalNat. And, since they already like CN, and it's available locally which Serengeti isn't, I'll stick with CalNat. OTOH, if it turns out there is a probalem with CN, I have no qualms about switching to Serengeti, if the cats like it.

BTW, whenever I've tried that carb math formula you mention, the carb level never matches what the manufacturer says it is, in those instancew where they list it. It's usually sort of close though. So, I guess it's good enough.

[Geff]

Geff,
Be sure to freeze your excess, even though it's unopened. It'll stay fresh untl you're ready to use it.

Hi Cindy - I asked you a couple questions about freezing in the storage thread.

[lacy]

I just read on the itchmo forums that someone decided against feeding California Natural because some of the ingredients came from China. Has anyone called or emailed to have them say that their ingredients are "U.S grown and processed" not just U.S. suppliers??? Im a little concerned now. My email I just got said

Dear Pet Lover,

All of our ingrediants are purchased in the United States.  We do not
purchase any of our vitamins etc from China or any foreign country.

I hope I have answered your question.

Thank you,
Customer Service

This is not very reassuring to me. Purchased does not mean they actually originate here. I hope they are not dancing around the subject. Feedback anyone?

[Javas Mom]

Lacy, if you go to naturapet.com and watch the video by Peter Atkins, the CEO, he leaves little doubt (in my mind anyway) that the ingredients are safe. About 3 minutes in he says, they "utilize ingredients only from domestic suppliers and to specifically exclude ingredients that might be sourced from China." You have to trust somebody or you can't trust anybody. I'm hoping I can trust him...

[lacy]

Well I just pulled up the video transcript. He says this "Also effective immediately, I have instructed our buyers to utilize ingredients from domestic suppliers only; and to specifically exclude any ingredients that might be sourced from China."
Does that mean, that before April 2, when the video was made, they had used ingredients from China? My bag is dated Feb.

[Javas Mom]

That would be an alarming thought, but we have to remember that Gary has been feeding his cats samples he received and then going out of his way to purchase bags specifically dated as far back as 11/22. I also have been feeding my three cats Cal. Nat. for over two years and my two newest bags dated March have appeared to be fine--so regardless, I don't think it should be too concerning. I think THEY are just intending to take every precaution they possibly can--much like we are doing. I hope that sets your mind at ease some.

[Geff]

Well I just pulled up the video transcript. He says this "Also effective immediately, I have instructed our buyers to utilize ingredients from domestic suppliers only; and to specifically exclude any ingredients that might be sourced from China."
Does that mean, that before April 2, when the video was made, they had used ingredients from China? My bag is dated Feb.

Hi Lacy - How are your cats doing?

[lacy]

Thank you Javas mom. It does put my mind at ease a little. 

Hey Geff. My kitties are doing okay. Everyone is eating, no one throwing up anymore. No more Coop scared of Franks E-collar (monster/lion) since we took it off. It took hime a day or so after we took it off for him to eat again! I am so thankful hes eating! My only concern now is that they are all in the litter box constantly. I am trying to spy on all three of them when they are in there, which is very hard to do!! They think I am playing everytime I sneak a peek around the corner. They are also doing this weird lip licking thing a lot. I have never noticed it before. I am hoping and praying they dont have a UTI or any crystals. I will keep spying on them. I hope I am not crazy worrying about the California Natural. This is just so stressful. They have already had two foods recalled before. Been to the vet too much for tests. Thank you guys for all your support and for always trying to put my mind at ease!!