Athena is a beautiful cat! Is she on prepared raw, RMB, or home ground?

Woo Hoo!!! We have a hit!! I didn't realize Herne hadn't tried the NV before. He's eating it as I type!! Yes !

It's the chicken and turkey variety. And I picked it up a couple of months ago. I decided to keep it just in case the ferrets ran out of Archetypal. I could break the medallions up and pick out all the pumpkin seeds if I really had to !
And thank you, Perseus! I will get them switched to a better diet if it kills me! Yesterday, I picked up around a dozen different varieties of canned, to try to find something Herne will eat, so who knows?

Tried the NV freeze dried, both wet and dry, no luck. However, I now have three cats taking the canned in the morning, and kibbles in the evening. I've started putting any oil from the canned on Herne's kibbles, as well as a few very small pieces of the canned food on it as well. He ate it . Also, Watson always has a few kibble sized pieces of raw when I feed the ferrets. Generally only 4-5, but still! He also had some of the blood from the turkey necks tonight, and seemed to love it! So we are making progress ! Not a lot yet, but still progress!

[I use the Natures Variety freeze dried as treats. Most cats and dogs seem to love the taste.]

I use the Natures Variety freeze dried as treats. Most cats and dogs seem to love the taste.

Do you give it dry, or rehydrated? With the ferrets, they like the Archetypal dry, but with cats, not a clue . Hard to believe I've had cats all my life, ferrets less than a year, but I know more about how to do their switch, and their diet, than I do my cats! Not  that I love one more or less than the other, but fuzzies were what got me into researching the whole diet thing in the first place! So any and all suggestions are more than welcome!

Might be worth a shot. I've got some Wysong's Archetypal 1 for the ferrets when we have to go anywhere(vet's, etc.). I picked up some NV freeze dried for them by mistake a short while ago. I can't give it to them because of the pumpkin seeds. Maybe I'll try kitties with it after the canned. See if they take to it

I would guess that canned food should be left out no longer than 1/2 hour to an hour at a time, especially if the climate is warm where you live.

Uh oh, I leave the canned out until it's gone...can be a couple of hours or more....I just thought if it was dried out and didn't taste good any more, they just wouldn't eat it, no?  I leave the canned out for the kittens when I leave for work, or sometimes overnight so they let me sleep.

I live in Calgary, Ab. Believe me, right now warm is not a problem ! But thanks for the info. When I've tried them with the canned before, it sat out for 3-4hrs(didn't know better- I know, bad girl!), with no ill effects. I really didn't realize it could be a problem for them. I thought the digestive process was fast enough to forstall that.

Tried them all with Fancy Feast(horrors, I know ) this morning. I could only get one to regularly try a better quality soft food. Three ate quite well! Unfortunately, the Siamese flatly refused! I'm hoping if I can at least get them on this junk, then I can start mixing a better canned slowly, til they are at least eating decently. Also unfortunately, I had to leave the dishes out for quite a while.
I just can't seem to get them off the bloody free feeding. They will simply nibble in the morning, then again in the evening. As I think I mentioned before, after a week of this, and them extremely hungry, I caved. Do you think it will hurt to leave the dishes out til the serving is finished? It's the canned. Thanks!

Really interesting articles! And they make a lot of sense. Thanks for posting them

The study below was quoted to me on another forum. Hope this is what you wanted


"Arnbjerg (1992) studied the time of passage of various commercial
food items through the stomach of dogs (25-30kg) by radiography. The
types of food used were (1) dried food with 10% moisture, (2) canned
food with 70% moisture, and (3) fresh food (fish) with 75% moisture.
After food ingestion the animals had no access to water or to any
other type of liquid.

In group 1, the food remained unchanged in the stomach for 8-10 hours
after completion of the meal. After 15 hours (+/- 1 hour) the stomach
appeared to be completely empty.

In group 2, the food started to enter the duodenum after 4.5 hours
(+/- 30 minutes). The stomach appeared to be empty 7-8 hours after eating.

In group 3, the food was observed in the duodenum 30 minutes after
ingestion and emptying was complete 4-6 hours after ingestion.

The results of fresh meat emptying are in agreement with the results
for labelled chicken liver reported by Cullen & Kelly (1996) who found
a gastric emptying time of 3.5 hours, including a lag phase of 71
minutes (+/- 9 minutes).

However, Meyer et al. (1985) found a faster gastric emptying (3 hours)
for radiolabeled steak and liver in large breed dogs (20-25kg body
weight).

Compared to Meyer et al. (1985) Burrows et al. (1985) observed
comparable results in half-emptying time in large breeds (26-32kg body
weight) using different isocaloric commercial diets. Canned meat based
food (77% moist), dry cereal based chow plus water (77% moist) and dry
cereal based food were emptied in 3.8 hours (+/- 36 minutes), 2.5
hours (+/- 36 minutes), and 2.4 hours (+/- 36 minutes) respectively
(differences not significant).

The large difference in half-emptying time of dry food between the
studies is probably due to the fact that sometimes, like in the study
of Arnjberg (1992), the dogs had no access to water."

Arnbjerg, J. (1992). Gastric Emptying Time in the Dog and Cat. Journal
of the American Animal Hospital Association. 28, 77-81

Taken from:
A Review of the Physiology of the Canine Digestive Tract Related to
the Development of in Vitro Systems, Nutrition Research Reviews
(1998), 11, 45-69

To the best of my understanding, the studies involving this were done when the animals were fed dry with no access to water to help in the digestion. That is why it took so long for the digestive processes to work. When water was allowed, the digestion took far less time. So raw and dry weren't such a problem.

Have you tried Evo 95% meat? Some of mine love it!

Actually, yes, I did. And I've already switched 4 ferrets to RMB. I just wish cats were as easy! Simply scruff several times, put on nose, done! Granted, it took two months for them, but they are there! Now, if I could only get hubby on line with it, it would be great!

First, the good news. Ligiea mostly prefers the canned, and Watson will actually eat some kibble sized pieces of raw, including most of a chicken heart last night ! Herne and Stubbs however, still won't touch anything but kibbles. Tried putting a bit in their food, and both left it. Oh, well. I'll just keep trying

First, let me say, thank you for all the interest in my brats and myself . This is such a pleasant change from some of the other cat forums I've been on!
Perseus- Ideally, I would like to get at least some of them on RMB, like the ferrets. Other than that, maybe a frozen commercial ground.
Right now, Watson(4yr old, eats on the counter) loves canned, has a few bites of some muscle meats when the ferrets eat, and wants access to his kibbles.
Herne(8yr old, night time eater) will have a bit of canned as a treat once in a while, but relies on kibbles.
Ligiea(10yr old, eats on counter), wants canned in the a.m., wants kibble rest of day.
Mr. Stubbs(14yr old, eats on bed), will only eat kibble, with the odd lick at canned.
One thing I have found- they all prefer Evo 95% meat canned.
All that said, I have tried feeding schedules. Even after a week, the cats will only nibble at the food for both sessions, then squawk all day for the kibbles to be put down. After a week, I was really getting concerned that my kibble addicts were not eating nearly enough to sustain them. I have to admit, the idea of putting the raw up after 30m-1hr will take some getting used to! With the ferrets, since they digest, and then poop it out withing 3hrs, you can leave the raw out for 24 hrs with no ill effects .
I'm going to try putting it beside their respective dishes for now, and see what they do. Wish me luck!