Those per cup numbers are all about the same comparative difference from each other as their kcal/kg numbers. That's to be expected, of course. But, I didn't expect the per cup numbers to be so high in general.

But, after about a week on Wellness Complete Chicken dry, and Chicken and Turkey canned, they haven't gotten chubby or anything. I know it's only a week. But, when Lucky and his previous girlfriend Tootles were eating Waltham Urinary food, they put on weight immediately. I think skinny Lucky may have put on a few ounces. But, he was getting too skinny anyway. And, he just loves this food, and gobbles down both the wet and dry like I've never seen him do with any other.

BTW, while Lucky was sitting on my desk last night, he noticed two pieces of the Indoor that I had been examining the night before, but which he didn't seem to care for at that time. Well, this time he gobbles them down, asks for more, and ate a bunch that I fed him right on my desk like it was a snack treat. Now I know that an Indoor/Core mix should go over well!

On second thought, if any of your beloved pets are sickened or injured by this, I just might! 

I guessed wayyyy wrong on the calories per cup. I was just going by typical amounts for similar foods, and the kcal/kg posted on the website. (My calculator batteries must be dying.  Yeah. That's it! )

I think what may be the case for Wellness dry formulas, is that since they are so dense, they have more calories per cup than another brand with the same calories per weight. That's just a guess, of course. But, I think a valid one based on the kibbles I've used over the years.

BTW, what were the exact numbers per cup for Core and Complete Chicken / Salmon, according to their email?

Not just apple juice, but a lot of produce is available locally in many states. Of course, I might be spoiled living in California with it's abundant farmland of fruits and vegetables. But, that is true of so many states. Washington for its apples; New York for it's apples; New Jersey for a variety of vegetables; almost all of the mid-western states for it's wheat, corn, potatoes; the southern states for their nuts and soybeans; Florida for it's oranges. Of course, all of those states grow much more than just those few things.

We need to curtail this global trade nonsense, or at least make sure that all global trading partners uphold the same high standards that our growers and manufacturers do (and they're not all that high, either), or we simply will not import their crap and garbage. We need to put our foot down, and stop acting like little whores and porn actresses willing to give up all they used to believe in for the lure of money.

The whole purpose of mixing was to provide higher protein in their dry while trying to reduce calories ... but if they pick through for the Chicken kibbles then I'm just going 100% Complete Care.

Complete Health and Core are roughly the same calories. So, you aren't reducing anything by mixing those two. (3845 kcal/kg for Core, 3950 for Complete Chicken, 3970 for Salmon.)

If, otoh, you mixed Core with Indoor Health or Healthy Weight, you would be reducing calories from Core alone. (3590 Indoor, 3490 Healthy Weight.)

Just so you know.

I'm sure the Healthy Weight is under 500 calories per cup. My guess would be under 400. Most non-prescription weight management formulas that I've seen seem to be between 300 and 400.

I wasn't planning on shooting anybody! 

Here's Natura's listed address in San Jose, according to ATT:

Natura Pet Products
1101 S Winchester Blvd Bldg J
San Jose, CA 95128
(408) 261-0770

I used to live around the corner from there for years. It's just one of those little commercial buildings with multiple small business tenants. This coming weekend, while I'm in that area, I will take a look. I'm curious.

It's still strikes me as odd that their published mailing address is a PO box in Santa Clara, though. It's nearby. But, still, it seems just a wee bit sleazy, doesn't it?

Here's an aerial shot. Don't let the size of the buildings fool you. Each one probably has 20 or more tenants.
http://maps.yahoo.com/#mvt=h&q1=1101+S+Winchester+Blvd++San+Jose%2C+CA+95128&trf=0&lon=-121.950179&lat=37.306258&mag=1

BTW, I found the street address of their dry food manufacturing plant in Nebraska:

Natura Manufacturing Inc.
2779 Rademakers Way
Fremont, NE 68025
(402) 727-0870

It was on on of the lab test reports located at: http://www.naturapet.com/about-natura/labresults.asp

Those of you looking for a reason to stay with Natura and CalNat can find reassurance in these reports. I can certainly understand why many would be reluctant to leave a food that has proved so beneficial in the past.

Mixing foods is a good idea. Im not sure how I feel about the grain free dry foods yet. Maybe I could mix the Indoor Health and the Complete Health. Mixing foods isnt bad right??

I've toyed with the idea of mixing Core and Complete.  I still might do that on down the line.

I guess I can wait until I run low on Complete before making that decision. I probably have a couple weeks worth left, though. (That 2.8lb bag goes a long way, even with two cats.)

I had no problem with the transition. However, I switched from CalNat to Innova first, then to Wellness.

I've had no problems with soft or stinky stools with Wellness so far. It's only been a few days, of course. But, I think I would have noticed changes in poop by now, with the short digestive system of cats.

If anything, it may be less stinky, now that I'm thinking about it. Previously, when Lucy pooped (lucky's were not too bad), I could smell it  for a while afterward, all over the 2nd floor of my house. And, that is with a covered litter box. I don't recall needing an oxygen mask anymore since switching. Hmmm. I'm gonna pay attention to see if that's indeed the case.

My cats are a bit overweight. Right now i am trying the Complete Health, but one thing I noticed is that is doesnt have L-Carnitine and I know that helps with weight loss.  The indoor and the healthy weight do have it. I have been reading that overweight cats actually need a high protein, high fat diet to lose weight, but the healthy weight and indoor cat have low protein and low fat. Im a little confused on this. Also my cats have more energy on higher protein diets. Im not sure what to do. It would be perfect if the complete health had L carnitine in it.

That's one reason I was contemplating a mix of Core and Indoor. It would provide a high 40% protein level, but with less fat and calories than either Core alone or Complete. Plus, it would have the benefits of Indoor, such as L-Carnitine, Glucosamine/Chondroitin, and Fiber, albeit at lower levels than Indoor alone.

You've done a lot! I've only stopped using them. Then again, I didn't actually find any foreign particles in the food.

Two things about Natura that have always struck me as a little shady and/or a little slick is that they do not post their street address. I know they are here in San Jose somewhere. But, there is no actual street address, just a PO Box, as if it's run out of someone's garage, or they are otherwise afraid people will know hwere to find them. And... why do they have so many brands? Innova, California Natural, Healthwise, Karma, Mother Nature? To me, that smacks more of marketing and business, not of pet care.

Disgusted! That's more like it!

Now, where's my cookies?

Avoiding companies that simply did business with Menu, even if not purchasing any actual Menu-made products, was just reactionary and made little sense. The money spent on a non-Menu-made product did not end up in Menu's pockets. There is no need to feel guilty at all about buying a non-Menu product from a company that uses Menu. None at all.

OTOH, avoiding Menu-made products made, and still makes, perfect sense, and is perfectly understandable. I do feel guilty about using Menu-made products now. And, it is a shame that I have had to resort to it, as you say. Why is the pet food industry so f-ed up like this?

The same goes for ANI. And, I wish I knew for sure whether any of the Wellness dry formulas are made by them. I might be forced to change brands yet again. I trust ANI even less than I trust Menu. Way less.